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Thank thank you for your response I do know the blazer rotor has a different offset and deeper thank the camaro so may go and pick up blazer set up also and see which works best for me once again thank you and good job
Originally Posted by cdrod
The bearing spacer fits around the axle inside the backing plate. Here's the finished product.
Olds442Toro:
There are 2 different OEM rotors for the Blazer rear discs (a 2WD and a 4WD version) both have the same diameter and thickness, but IIRC the 4WD rotor has a deeper "hat" section requiring a greater offset. I forget which one I used, probably the 2WD rotor - see the attached pdf files. Good luck.
Interesting note. I am running the same front and rear brake set up on mine with a drum brake dual master cylinder and booster. I have not added a proportioning valve as of yet. It stops extremely well and under lock up applications bias is just about perfect.
P.S I also have the Bandit wheels on mine as well. They look great and are one of the few options that fit over the corvette front brakes.
The balance of dual drum and dual disc masters are the same. The only potential issue is the residual valve. Most drum masters have a 10psi residual valve build into the master. On drums, this keeps the drum cylinder seals slightly pressurized, which is necessary because of how they're built. Otherwise they'll leak. But the springs keep the shoes off the drum. On disc, this will keep the calipers very slightly engaged, leading to fast pad wear.
The other bit of the brake system is the prop valve. If the discs/pads/calipers are sized just right, then a prop valve isn't necessary. Note that combo/prop valves for rear drums have other goodies - metering and hold-off stuff - which are very bad in a rear disc configuration. A straight distribution block is just fine for disc/disc though.
The balance of dual drum and dual disc masters are the same. The only potential issue is the residual valve. Most drum masters have a 10psi residual valve build into the master. On drums, this keeps the drum cylinder seals slightly pressurized, which is necessary because of how they're built. Otherwise they'll leak. But the springs keep the shoes off the drum. On disc, this will keep the calipers very slightly engaged, leading to fast pad wear.
The other bit of the brake system is the prop valve. If the discs/pads/calipers are sized just right, then a prop valve isn't necessary. Note that combo/prop valves for rear drums have other goodies - metering and hold-off stuff - which are very bad in a rear disc configuration. A straight distribution block is just fine for disc/disc though.
what did you do to keep the bearing and seal in place on yours in rear or did you have C clip axles?? That will be my main hurdle with the bolt in olds axles
Its been a while
looking forward to some post
thanks for what you have given
Kelly
sorry guys been crazy lately not much time to work on the 442 BUT have made some progress. And also in process of building a rotisserie for it once all the pans are replaced
New firewall in!!!!!!
Man, I've been so delinquent in keeping this thread up to date! Ropewrench, Thank you for your offer to lend a hand. I may yet take you up on the offer! I was building my car in an empty warehouse space at the recording studio that I owned with a couple of partners. It was a 20-minute drive from my house, which made it difficult to keep the momentum on my project. Then we sold the studio and I lost my workshop space. The good news is I brought the car home to my garage, it’s so much easier to keep moving, I can just pop into the garage for 30 minutes to work on something without having to drive across town. The bad news is my project is in the garage…so my wife's new car is out in the driveway. She’s not too pleased! The other huge task in relocating was moving all the extra parts I've collected into a storage unit...and I have quite an assortment of spare parts.
I've managed to work on lots of smaller components in the 2 years since my last post, but most recently I've rediscovered my groove on this project. Here's a quick update on my progress:
Engine & trans installed:
Still need to ceramic coat the LH header.
Rebuilt the AC evaporator suitcase:
I installed a new blower motor and evaporator and rebuilt the wiring sub-harness. The new evaporator I bought was damaged in shipping and the main tube was bent. The replacement arrived in good condition and fit properly. The summers in Houston get incredibly hot, so I also installed some heat shielding to the fire wall and the AC suitcase to improve the performance of the AC.
Header Install: I decided on Hooker 3901 headers because the 5/16” flanges are thicker than most other brands and the 1-5/8” primary tubes are 16 gauge where most have 18 gauge primary tubes. Unfortunately, I had significant fitment issues with these headers and the replacement set they sent me didn’t fit any better. In the end, I had to modify 2 primary tubes to clear the lower control arm and I flattened a third tube (just a little) to clear the LCA frame mount. It was frustrating that they didn’t fit out of the box but I was happy with them after the modifications. I also had them ceramic coated to lower the under hood temps. Here is a link to my header thread
The 2 bottom primary tubes are hitting the lower control arm.
Before modification (RH), after mod (LH)
Wheels:
I selected Bandit 18” rims for better tire selection and so I could run 13” front brake rotors, but I never liked the center caps that came with the rims. So, I modified some stock retainers to install SSI center caps. They look a little small on the 18" rims, but overall I’m very happy with the outcome.
18" Bandit rim w/SSI center cap.
Stainless steel studs and nuts for the wheel retainers.
Body work and rust removal:
Using a wire wheel, I ground out all the seam sealer from the cowl & firewall. There was a surprising amount of rust hiding in these seams. I used Ospho to treat the rust at the seams and in the side cowl panels. I stripped the trunk floor, plug welded a few pin holes (where it had rusted through) and undercoated the bottom. I also restored the emissions stand pipe (mounted behind the back seat) as well as tank vent hardware and installed new vent lines to the gas tank.
The silver stuff is the heat shielding behind the AC suitcase.
Outer wheelhouses installed.
Last edited by cdrod; June 17th, 2019 at 01:39 PM.
dc2x4drvr:
Thanks for the thumbs up! I purchased a stamped restomod tank from Ricks Tanks which looks like a stock tank but has cutouts for a 5th gen Camaro fuel pump module and level sensor. By replacing the internal poppet valve in the 5th gen fuel module with a 4th gen poppet valve the fuel module will regulate the fuel pressure at 58pis and internally bypass any excess fuel. This allows me to run a dead-headed fuel system without a return line. The 5th gen Camaro module can support up to 450HP which is perfect for my needs. I'll be running a FiTech EFI throttle body system with a PWM fuel pump feed which slows down the fuel pump at idle (when the fuel demand is low) and increase the pump speed to meet the engine demand. Here's some pics:
LS3 Camaro fuel pump module. I bought the poppet valve and adapter from carl@vaporworx.com.
Ricks Restomod tank.
Last edited by cdrod; June 17th, 2019 at 05:07 PM.
I'm running a 1970 combination valve for front-rear brake distribution. Inline Tube helped me out with this one; because I have a disc-disc system, I needed a distribution block only w/o the residual valving for drum brakes. The '70 model A-body cars had a separate residual valve for the rear drum brakes mounted in the rear and the combination valve mounted on the LH, front frame rail was only used to split the front & rear systems w/o the residual valving. The Inline Tube part number for the'70s combo valve is PR107.
My brake force calculations show that a dual 9" vacuum booster with a 1" disc-disc master cylinder should provide an additional 17% braking force with the C5 front disc set-up. That assumes 17in vacuum and using the stock power brake pedal ratio; if I want more whoa for my giddy-up, I can increase the pedal ratio at the expense of some additional pedal travel. Using the manual brake pedal ratio nets a brake force increase of 42%, so there is a lot of room in between to dial it in!
Last edited by cdrod; June 17th, 2019 at 02:11 PM.
I decided to make the switch to fuel injection... after I purchased and installed the standard fuel line kit from Inline Tube. The INL parts included a 3/8" stainless supply line and a 1/4" stainless return line. I've repurposed the 1/4" line to use for the emissions vapor line. The stock tubing was 5/16", but I'll make the 1/4" line work with a few hose reducers. I'm concerned about the higher system pressure for EFI, specifically, the transitions from hard line to flexible line (like at the tank and RH front frame rail). I purchased some J30R14 low-permeation, hose from Gates to use at these locations; it's designed to work with modern fuels. I also bought some Earl's Vaporgaurd EFI rated hose clamps. I've mounted an 10-micron in-line, post filter (per the FiTech install docs) on the RH frame rail. I'll use ProFlo J30R9 braided line from the Holley filter up to the throttle body.
Do you guys see and issues with my connections?
Gates Barricade low-permeation hose from the 3/8" hardline to the fuel filter. The 1/4" line will be used for the emissions vapor line.
Holley 10-micron fuel filter.
Last edited by cdrod; June 17th, 2019 at 04:09 PM.
I sent the reworked Hooker header to PolyDyn here in Houston to have it thermal coated to match the RH side. I picked it up on Friday and got ready to install but couldn't get it fit! Sure enough, it was hitting the frame in 3 (yes THREE!) places. How could this be? I had spent hours a few days ago reworking the 2 primary tubes that were hitting the LCA. I took the header back out and removed the copper gasket so I wouldn't damage it while F-ing around with this this @*$&% header!! I didn't see any obvious issues so I reinstalled the header...without the copper gasket...and it fit perfectly!! I should have allowed for the gasket thickness when I reworked the header - DUH! SO, I got out my BFH and beat the living s*$# on three of the primary tubes to clear the frame. The only saving grace in this whole header debacle is the BFH beating can't be seen because the dents are right up agains the frame and crossmember.
After fighting with the header, I moved on to other assembly items: torqued the trans cross-member bolts, connected the back-drive linkage to the shift selector, and then moved on to a valve cover project. The M/T valve covers did not come with baffles installed, the mounting posts weren't even tapped. So I tapped them for a 8-32 screw and cut some 16 gauge sheetmetal into 1"x3" baffles. Once I finished the baffles I spent the next 2 hours polishing and buffing the aluminum covers with some polishing compound I bought and the a car show a few years ago (the sales girl was super cute). The polishing job probably could be better but it is definitely an improvement. Here's some pics:
Tap for 8-32 screws to hold baffle plates.
I hope the baffle is big enough limit oil flow into the PCV.
Do you have A/C? Just wondering what the clearance is like on right side. I have same valve covers but haven't installed them yet.
I do have AC but not running stock heads or intake. I have aluminum heads and an Edelbrock 7111 intake; I had to grind a little bit to get the AC brackets to fit properly but no fitment problems with the valve covers. It is pretty close though. Here's some pics:
RH valve cover.
There's about 1/4" clearance between the AC bracket and the valve cover.
Last edited by cdrod; June 23rd, 2019 at 02:13 PM.
Reason: added pics
Thanks I'm going with aluminum heads also but a procomp single plain intake.
That anchor bolt on the intake is not strictly necessary, but it's a very good idea. I just left it out for about 10 years when I installed an edelbrock intake, it didn't line up, and I couldn't be bothered to fix it. Just make sure all the other mounting points are very tight.
That anchor bolt on the intake is not strictly necessary, but it's a very good idea. I just left it out for about 10 years when I installed an edelbrock intake, it didn't line up, and I couldn't be bothered to fix it. Just make sure all the other mounting points are very tight.
I had problems getting the U-shaped AC mount to line up properly; all 3 mounting holes either didn't line up or the angle wasn't correct. I thought about running without the rear AC mount as it weighs a hefty 4 lbs. and I've been trimming weight wherever I can, but in the end I decided the rear mount will better support the AC compressor and keep things lined-up. Using a grinder and large flat file, I carefully adjusted the intake mounting boss and all three holes on the rear AC bracket until it fit and and the bolts didn't bind up when I tighten them. I was happy to see the AC mount cleared the M/T valve cover because I really like the way these covers look on my motor.
Yeah, I ended up JB-welding a threaded alum rod into the hold in the intake then redrilling and tapping the hole where the bracket wanted it. The bracket is important because it keeps the compressor from twisting. But the stud mount on the head is fairly effective at supporting it for that, so the intake bolt isn't wildly necessary.
I tried cutting off the end of the bracket and welding it on where the intake wanted it. That resulted as expected - weld fell apart after a month or so.
We have annual vehicle inspections here in Texas, and one of the requirements to pass the state inspection is a functioning parking brake. So when I was researching my options for a rear disc brake swap, a dependable parking brake was high on my priority list. The rear disc set-up on my car is from a 2001 Blazer 2WD, which has a drum-in-hat style parking brake. This is essentially an miniature drum brake used to lock up the rear wheels and it's found on 4th gen Camaros and C5 Vettes as well as the Blazer. The parking brake is independent of the caliper and is actuated by a small lever on the backing plate, but the Blazer cables are much longer the stock drum cables. So, I purchased the shortest Blazer cables I could find (66" long) and set out to shorten them. It wasn't all that difficult:
I started with the 66" long Blazer cable. This is a Dorman part#C95546.
First, I cut off the stop at the front end of the cable.
To remove the mounting ferule, I heated the ferule (just a little) and gave it a good tug using the vise to pull the ferule off. Don't heat it too much or you permanently melt the vinyl sheathing on the cable.
I cut the cable housing to the correct length. I did a practice cut with the grinder but it put too much heat into the housing and melted the vinyl covering. I used a sawzall instead and cleaned up the cut with a flap-disc.
The steel cable inside the housing is 1/8" diameter. I sized up the length comparing to the stock drum cable and crimped on a new cable stop.
Here are the finished products; one for each side!
Last edited by cdrod; June 25th, 2019 at 07:40 PM.
Reason: typos
It's been 6 months since my last post so I thought I should write an update about my progress.
I finished the plumbing & wiring for the in-tank, fuel pump. The pump module is from a 5th gen Camaro and will be PWM controlled by the FiTech throttle body. The FiTech uses PWM to slow down the pump when full volume is not needed like at idle and light cruising. PWM is very cool, but one of the issues with PWM is EMI noise. I'm planning a high-power stereo system with an 800w amp in the trunk and the power feed to the fuel pump will run directly below the location of the amp and the audio wiring. To mitigate a future noise problem, I used some 11 gauge, coax cable designed for ham radio transmitters to feed the PWM power to the fuel pump. I grounded the shield to keep the EMI noise from radiating into other circuits. I ran the coax cable along the drivers side of the car to avoid the AC suitcase on the passenger side of the firewall. I hope it works, I hate noisy stereos!
I'm also planning to install a pair of metal-core, race cats to clean up the exhaust. I'm not sure what the operating temp of the cats will be but I'd heard they can get pretty hot. To keep things cool inside the car, I installed some peal & stick, heat shield material from DEI to the undercarriage above the cats. I also sprayed the bottom of the floorpan with some Rustoleum rattle can bed liner. I wasn't too impressed with the Rustoleum stuff but it provided a nice satin finish.
Getting the body back on the frame was a very hair-raising experience! Fortunately everything lined up and the body bushing bolts fit without any problems.
Last edited by cdrod; December 1st, 2019 at 05:17 PM.
Reason: typos
I also enclosed part of the rear seat brace to create a built-in sub-woofer box. The rear seat brace in a convertible creates a triangular space behind the seat and the top well. I fit some triangle shaped plywood dividers inside the space to close off the ends and cut pieces to fit tightly inside the irregular cutouts on the seat side. I then screwed a 1/2" thick piece of plywood to seal off the trunk side and mount the 8" sub. I'm using a JL Audio 8" sub that works best in a sealed box with an internal volume of .35 cu.ft. The space behind the seat works out to be just under .37 cu.ft. Here's some pics:
Sealed off the holes on the seat side of the divider.
Added 3 plywood dividers to seal the end of the sub enclosure and make the sheet metal more rigid.
Added 1/2" plywood baffle to the trunk side to mount the 8" sub-woofer.
Last edited by cdrod; December 1st, 2019 at 05:15 PM.
Reason: typos
I finally finished hardlines for the transmission cooler and a power steering cooler. I bought bulk steel tubing from Jegs and bent my own lines...which was much harder than I expected, but I'm very satisfied with the end results. The power steering cooler it just a loop of steel tubing and may be completely unnecessary but the temps in Houston can be unbearable in the summer time and I had the perfect spot for it. Here's some pics:
Looking good Rod. What did you use to punch out the holes in your core support? I like the look.
Dwight
Dwight:
I have a punch die for the 1" holes that cuts and flares the hole in a single step using a socket wrench to tighten the punch. For the smaller holes I have a set of flaring dies but I have to drill the holes first, then use a large C-clamp or a a ball joint tool to compress the flaring die. The smaller holes were much more work because of the 2-step process and the C-clamp tends to wander as you tighten it, which screws up the flare. My goal was to lighten the front-end. I punched holes in the top & bottom rails of the core support, a few more in the headlight mounting areas and in the center support. These holes, in combination with aluminum heads, intake manifold & water pump, an aluminum AC compressor and an aluminum radiator took about 130 lbs of sprung weight off the front end of the car. The aluminum wheels, and Corvette brake calipers & rotors took another 23 lbs of un-sprung weight off the front suspension (11.5 lbs. at each wheel). That should improve suspension response and handling. I can't wait to get it on the road!! Here's a pic of the punch dies.
You punched holes in the top of the core support?!?!?! The built-in tool shelf on our cars is literally my favorite feature!
I only drilled holes in the cross beam (under the radiator top plate). As you can see from my pic, I make good use of the built-in tool shelf. I hate working on my late model cars as my tools always seem to end up on the ground at least 4-5 times during the course of a repair.
The bolt that mounts the brake pedal seems to have too much clearance (.042") which makes the pedal wobble side to side. The clearance is between the bolt and the metal sleeve that fits inside the brake pedal arm. I know these cars weren't built to a high degree of precision, but is this amount of wobble typical or have my parts worn to cause this looseness? Do the bushing kits sold by Iinline Tube & Fusick include a new metal sleeve or just the plastic bits? Thanks!
I bench bled the master cylinder yesterday. I'm installing an aftermarket brake booster from Tuff Stuff and the brake pedal pushrod was shorter than the factory booster...so I had to fab up an extension using a 3/8-24 coupling nut and 1" bolt. Today, I finished plumbing the M/C and the proportioning valve for the rear discs and fabricated a simple bracket to mount the valve to the M/C. Now on to the arduous task of bleeding the entire brake system, which brings up a question. After bench bleeding the M/C, brake fluid would drip from the open ports. Is this normal? It seems like the M/C would drip out all the fluid if left un-capped for a long time. Anyway, here's a few pics:
Last edited by cdrod; January 18th, 2020 at 05:32 PM.
Oddball:
Thanks for the compliment.
I fabricated up a pressure bleeder from an old water bottle, a scrap piece of 1/4" aluminum plate, a needle valve and some plastic tubing. Parts total was about $35. This sure beats the hell out of the 2-man, pumping the brake pedal method, but I have a questions about the proportioning valve. How do I make sure to get all the air out of the prop valve? Here's some pics:
I posted my proportioning valve question in another thread, and the general. consensus there was to bleed the brakes with the prop valve at maximum pressure. I messed with the valve settings after bleeding and the brake pedal is firm regardless of the prop valve position.
April 11th, 2017, 12:21 PM
