Supernaut72

After installing the new PCV fitting into the carb and fiddling around with the engine, I found that with it warm and the choke off, it still wouldn't hold an idle very well. It would idle smoothly at a low speed, but then stumble like it was going to die; then, after being saved by generous opening of the throttle, it would continue idling.

I figured I'd check for vacuum leaks again, since that was the only thing I could think of that might cause the leak now that the petrified carb gasket is replaced and the dried/cracked hoses have been taken care of. The line to the transmission's modulator tasted like tranny fluid, indicating another part I should probably inspect, but it was holding vacuum very well. Everything still seemed to be holding vacuum, except...
Yup, turns out the dizzy's vacuum advance is completely shot. Musta went sometime recent, because during my initial vacuum checks it held vacuum (even if its action wasn't as smooth as I'd like). As of now, sucking on the vacuum hose it feels like the hose isn't connected to anything at all. New vac advance ordered.

Not pertinent to how the car runs, but the alternator's pulley is slightly cocked to one side, and scrapes against its bracket (which also has a break in it, on the outer edge of the channel that the alternator nut is supposed to clamp down on). I suspect that that's the cause of the awful "bad pulley bearing" noise I was hearing when I ran the engine.

Also found that the radiator is not only leaking from a weld seam on the driver's side end tank, but it's also got a pretty nasty leak right amid the cores, just outside of the fan shroud on the driver's side. That explains why the coolant keeps getting so low so quickly. Currently looking for new radiators, since any hope of even doing a patchwork fix for winter driving with some radiator putty has gone out the window.

The radiators I see online typically mention being constructed with a "plastic tank". How does this compare to the originals? Should I try and find one that doesn't have "plastic tank" in the description or is that pretty much all that's available as far as OE-style rads go?
I'm definitely going OEM style, I've had bad trouble with non-stock style radiators in cars in the past and I'm not really made of money so I'm not interested in any small advantages a non-stock one might offer. Anyone here had to replace a radiator in one of these cars in recent years?


After the vac advance and rad are taken care of, it sounds like this engine should purr. Here's hoping.

Supernaut72

Got my new radiator last night. Dummies mislabeled the box at the factory, if I'm to assume that Murray isn't trying to screw me with a false item description. Murray part #433165 is supposed to have old-school copper cores and metal side tanks. The one I got was made of cheap aluminum with plastic tanks. Took it back, waiting to see if they'll get it right on Wednesday or if I'll have to break down and buy a Vista-Pro rad for a hundred or so dollars extra.

New vacuum advance really helped the engine, it idled well but I didn't want to fully warm it up with the radiator leaking as badly as it is. Had to back the timing down a bit after installing the new advance, as the engine was kicking back against the starter and wouldn't turn over, but once I did it fired up without a problem.

The loud ticking still unnerved me, so I tried retarding the timing even more by moving all of the spark plugs one position counter-clockwise to see if perhaps a PO had put the plugs on in the correct order, but in the wrong places. The engine cranked without starting when I did that, so I guess I can rule out incorrect timing as the culprit behind the noise (having previously dealt with a timing fiasco on a SBC caused by a harmonic balancer that had slipped, I don't trust timing marks 100%).

Since I've also established that the rockers are getting oil and the noise persists even after dousing them in MMO while running, it looks to me like the clacking sound I'm hearing is simply worn rocker perches or a rather noisy exhaust leak from one or both exhaust manifolds. With that settled, I guess I'll stop worrying about the engine so much and actually start using it once the car's got the new wheels and radiator installed.

After all that it'll be time to do some interior surgery to do some rust-proofing, lubricate window/lock mechanisms, replace weather seals, and maybe try to figure out why the "Heater" button of my climate control panel isn't engaging when I push it.

One step at a time!

MDchanic

The plastic / aluminum radiators probably won't last fifty years like the original did, but, believe it or not, they generally do cool better.

If I hadn't gotten a good deal on a replacement radiator from a member here, I would have gone aluminum.

Glad to see you're making progress.

- Eric

Supernaut72

The better heat conduction of an aluminum rad actually was tempting, but something about putting 200 degree coolant through plastic end tanks at 15 PSI makes me a bit nervous (even if others haven't had too much trouble with that in the past). Though honestly, the main reason I took the thing back down there and had them order another one is that they had charged me copper-core prices for it! haha

Yep, progress is slow but steady.
Weather seals for roof-rail, doors, and trunk just arrived today, fortunately I was home this time and didn't miss the delivery again.
UNfortunately, I only found out from the packaging itself that the quarter glass pillar seals I bought, Metro #ALP 5053, is for 2dr HTs and 'verts, but for some reason isn't compatible with fastback models... No mention of the fastback exclusion on rockauto. I'll take a look at the ones on the car first, but it looks like I'll either be trying to return these seals or will just toss them up for sale in hopes that someone with a '67/'68 88 or 98 convertible can use them.

As for weather strip adhesive, I've got a tube of yellow 3M 08001 that I've been trying to find a use for for years. The seal packaging recommends 08008, but I wonder if that's only because black adhesive would be less noticeable if it squishes out a little. The MSDS between the two products isn't identical, but very similar; 08008 contains a few more ingredients, so hopefully one of the ingredients missing from 08001 isn't a compound that prevents it from melting paint.

jaunty75

I think this is much ado about nothing. I don't see any difference in the door pillar profile or anything like that on the D-88 Custom versus the D-88. Oldsmobile never used the term "fastback" to describe the body style of the Custom. The differences between the D-88 Custom and the "plain" D-88 were in the areas of exterior and interior trim, interior appointments, choices of interior color and fabric, that sort of thing, not in the basic shape of the body. I think the pillar seals you bought will fit just fine. I think the issue of "fastback" would come up with other makes as the Metro site does say that this piece also fits some Buicks, Pontiacs, Chevrolets, and Cadillacs and that warning on the package is generic and not specific to Oldsmobile.

MDchanic

I'd throw the yellow adhesive out and buy a tube of the black.

The yellow is old anyway, and, believe me, you do not want to be chasing tiny bits of bright yellow smeary goop against flat black weatherstripping, trying to mop them up without smearing them or getting them all over the paint.

- Eric

jaunty75

I think there's a little too much thinking going on here, too. Either one is fine, and I've never looked at the MSDS of anything I've ever bought for my cars, and I've been working on them for more than 40 years.

The difference in these two adhesives is likely just the fact that one is yellow and one is black. I don't think it has anything to do with whether or not one attacks paint and the other doesn't. No one would buy an adhesive that attacks paint, and I doubt any manufacturer would sell an adhesive for this purpose that did.

I prefer the yellow because you can actually see where you've applied it to the weatherstrip and where you haven't. With the black, this is a little more difficult. The yellow doesn't stay yellow when it dries, anyway (it darkens), and, properly applied, you won't see the adhesive, anyway, regardless of its color.

jaunty75

To each his own.

I do agree, though, that anything five years old is likely to be no good now, anyway, even if the tube has never been opened.

jaunty75

The yellow is also a little cheaper. $7.66 at Amazon versus $10.63 for the black.

Supernaut72

I'll have a look when I'm at the car, but I guess it makes sense that the seal would work. Their application description very specifically stating "not fastback" kind of worried me, but for all I know it could fit perfectly. I'll probably be having a look tomorrow, hopefully at the same time as I refresh the car's cooling system.


I agree that it's doubtful, but over on a Corvette forum I had seen pictures from someone who had received a cheap "automotive weather seal super adhesive" with a weather strip kit. When he removed the seal for one reason or another, a large band of paint was missing where the adhesive had been on his car's door.
I know 3M is far superior to generic "super adhesive" crap, but I just wanted to be sure that yellow adhesive wasn't the antichrist of 3M products (especially since the box does say "may soften some paints" and "may cause failure of the paint bond"). If you use their yellow adhesive without issues though, I guess it's nothing.

I'll test the adhesive on something before it goes anywhere near the car to see if this tube is still any good, but I guess it's a good idea to buy another tube of it just to be safe. Good points on both the yellow and black adhesive, not sure which I'll go with but if they both dry pretty dark it probably won't matter too much in the end.

MDchanic

Yeah, there is no functional difference between the two adhesives, they're just different colors.

In the old days, contact cement, of which this is one type, only came in mustard yellow. I think it took a few decades for them to figure out how to make it black, or just for them to think of the idea of making it black.

- Eric

Supernaut72

Wellp, Murray/O'Reilly, one or both, kinda screwed me over on that radiator. They only updated their listing to accurately reflect that Murray #433165 is aluminum/plastic after we'd received two of the damned things from them, and I'd wasted plenty of time and gas motoring back and forth to look over the radiator with the clerks. I'd have given up and just thrown an aluminum rad into the car by this point, except for the fact that if I had a mind to, I could find one of them for nearly $100 cheaper elsewhere.

Looks like Pepboys might carry Spectra #CU302 for a good price, especially for a radiator that I might be able to have on-hand within a day or two, so I'll be talking with them in a few hours. Hopefully Spectra has their product descriptions in order, though even if this one really has a copper core, it looks like all I'll be getting is a 3-row rad similar to the original. Oh well, the heavy-duty fan clutch, six-blade stock fan and a cool thermostat ought to keep this thing running cool enough through the AZ summers... If not, I'll be notching up to the Hayden 2797.

Aside from slowly discovering that the entire cooling system needed restoration, things seem to be going pretty smoothly.
Ordering butyl tape for the super-leaky rear window today, might need some tips & tricks for that when it comes time but I figure that info shouldn't be too hard to find. Weather seals should be going in soon enough, too.
For those who've asked, pics really will be shared soon, I promise! Soon as these Daytons are off the car and out of my life.

MDchanic

Not to confuse things any more for you, but...

The aftermarket copper radiators may or may not have the same number of fins per inch as the originals.
If they have less, they will cool less, even though they appear to be the "same size."

- Eric

Supernaut72

Yeah, I'm counting on things like that causing problems. I'll make sure to compare the replacement to the original in any case so I'll know what's up if the car runs too hot and can make adjustments to/swap out the other cooling system components accordingly.

Sure wish I could find a good reconditioned Harrison for a decent price. We had a '67 and a '69 Olds 98 at the junk yard last time I was there that might have been able to donate a radiator, but this was a good year before I bought this Olds. Even if they still had those two rads in stock, they'd probably be in no better condition than this car's radiator, though.

jaunty75

Have you looked at Autozone for a radiator? They seem to have exactly what you need. All metal construction (brass tanks, copper fins). Heavy-duty capacity. For 2- or 4-bbl carb engines. Spectra-Premium brand. Price seems right.



http://www.autozone.com/cooling-and-...7_266534_2577/


Part number A302, $214.99. Order in store, or have it shipped to your home with free shipping.

Supernaut72

Huh, thanks for the lead, I'll check out what they have to offer. I hadn't tried Autozone, since I figured their stock would be the same junk O'Reilly carries. I spoke with them a little earlier, I guess I'll have to get down there before 2 PM local time on a weekday, and they can call their distribution center directly and find out what the radiator's made out of before I bother putting down any money and waiting a couple days for it to arrive.

The Spectra 302 radiators do look promising, though so did the Murray one. Fingers crossed!
If this doesn't work out then I think I'm only left with a couple more options: Give Vista-Pro a chance, or try and have my radiator or another old Harrison completely overhauled at a local shop (iffy, given that the both the tank and cores of mine are fatigued and leaking pretty badly).

On the bright side, all this radiator hunting is giving me plenty of time to find the last two used tires that I'm looking for. P215/70r14s just aren't as common as they used to be, I guess. At least not around here.

MDchanic

It's all the same radiator: Spectra A302 and Spectra CU302.

The AutoZone site gives both numbers in its listing as equivalents.

The interesting thing is, of course, that the letter A is known to stand for "Aluminum," while the letters "Cu" are known to stand for "Cuprium" or Copper.

The Spectra site gives their number CU165 for "With A/C or Heavy Duty Cooling" and the CU302 for "All except Heavy Duty Cooling."
You can have the auto parts store cross reference those numbers in their book.

By the way, Amazon has the , and the , both with free shipping.

- Eric

nsnarsk65cutlass

That's all you see mostly now is the plastic aluminum radiators for the older cars, no doubt they will not last as long,they may cool well but the plastic will not hold up like the brass copper of old.If you have an OE brass copper one recore it if you can find someone that still does it.

Supernaut72

Thanks for the part number explanation, didn't know that but should've pieced it together. And thanks a bunch for the Amazon links, that's a much better deal than the $300+ that I've seen most copper radiators go for on ebay. With any luck, that will be the end of my search.


And yep, I'm seriously considering a re-core if I get one more aluminum/plastic radiator instead of the copper that I paid for (fortunately that CU165 looks to be the real deal, unlike that garbage Murray was trying to sell me). Any ideas what the usual rates are for a job like that? I'm betting, not cheap.
Either way I go, I hope to have this cooling system back together before month's end!