Where are the edges of the middle?...
August 29th, 2012, 03:04 PM
#1
Got wood? I do! (an '89)
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Southeast Michigan
Posts: 310
Where are the edges of the middle?...
Many of you have Oldsmobiles younger than my '89 and while others' are older, so this seems like a pretty good cross-section of folks to ask.
When I was down at the local parts shop looking for something or other I was stunned by how expensive that part was. So, being the halfway-decent journalist I am I followed up by having him look up the same part on a newer model and then an older one.
Both were cheaper. And in stock, which mine wasn't.
I then went poking around some pick-n-pull-type places for various interior and exterior bits and not only were the old/new parts cheaper, they were actually the only ones even available.
So here's the situation: We have old(er) cars that are "classics" and for which there are now making replacement parts and then new(er) ones for which you can pretty much find everything at a dealer (for 10 years by law), auto parts place, etc.
Which begs the question: What's the deal with the "middle"? How long does it take a car to get old enough that you start having problems finding parts vs. when does it then get old enough that people start caring about them enough to start building parts anew?
It seems to work like this:
a.) Car is new and everything's available;
b.) Car goes out of fashion and is replaced, dropping its value until it hits "beater" status and/or enough of them are wrecked that parts are available and cheaper;
c.) Car drops to scrap value and even finding one becomes near-impossible unless it's a model worth "hoarding" for future value; and
d.) Car either disappears without a trace or is popular enough that bits--including re-manufactured ones--are an eBay click away.
Take my Custom Cruiser's "wood" trim. Now 1989 wasn't THAT long ago, but you have a better chance of finding a piece of the true cross than a set of replacement "sticker" panels. Sure, you can find places that will manufacture a "close enough-ish" set and those that "wrap" vehicles now for advertising purposes who will give it a go, but actual replacements?
Uh, no.
So, will it be my kids or grandkids that will be around when they decide that the cars are worth enough to start REALLY "re-manning" such parts? Wagons are getting more popular every day, so I can realistically assume the parts'll come.
But, as is usually the case, it sucks to be stuck here in the middle...
When I was down at the local parts shop looking for something or other I was stunned by how expensive that part was. So, being the halfway-decent journalist I am I followed up by having him look up the same part on a newer model and then an older one.
Both were cheaper. And in stock, which mine wasn't.
I then went poking around some pick-n-pull-type places for various interior and exterior bits and not only were the old/new parts cheaper, they were actually the only ones even available.
So here's the situation: We have old(er) cars that are "classics" and for which there are now making replacement parts and then new(er) ones for which you can pretty much find everything at a dealer (for 10 years by law), auto parts place, etc.
Which begs the question: What's the deal with the "middle"? How long does it take a car to get old enough that you start having problems finding parts vs. when does it then get old enough that people start caring about them enough to start building parts anew?
It seems to work like this:
a.) Car is new and everything's available;
b.) Car goes out of fashion and is replaced, dropping its value until it hits "beater" status and/or enough of them are wrecked that parts are available and cheaper;
c.) Car drops to scrap value and even finding one becomes near-impossible unless it's a model worth "hoarding" for future value; and
d.) Car either disappears without a trace or is popular enough that bits--including re-manufactured ones--are an eBay click away.
Take my Custom Cruiser's "wood" trim. Now 1989 wasn't THAT long ago, but you have a better chance of finding a piece of the true cross than a set of replacement "sticker" panels. Sure, you can find places that will manufacture a "close enough-ish" set and those that "wrap" vehicles now for advertising purposes who will give it a go, but actual replacements?
Uh, no.
So, will it be my kids or grandkids that will be around when they decide that the cars are worth enough to start REALLY "re-manning" such parts? Wagons are getting more popular every day, so I can realistically assume the parts'll come.
But, as is usually the case, it sucks to be stuck here in the middle...
Last edited by auto_editor; August 29th, 2012 at 03:08 PM.
August 29th, 2012, 03:54 PM
#2
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Poteau, Ok
Posts: 40,624
Ok, since your a writer, I want to set something straight. There is no Oldsmobile that falls under the true definition of a Classic. They are Antiques, Collectables, Musclecars, or just plain old cars. I don't care what States put on the License Plates.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classic_car
The intended lifespan of your car has far been exceded, so no there will not be any of the sticky imitation wood decals available at your local parts store. The availability of powertrain parts will be available as long as there is a market for them. At some point in time, body, trim and interior, become available on the aftermarket, again if there is a substantial demand. It's purely business!
I understand you feel left out, but it is what it is.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classic_car
The intended lifespan of your car has far been exceded, so no there will not be any of the sticky imitation wood decals available at your local parts store. The availability of powertrain parts will be available as long as there is a market for them. At some point in time, body, trim and interior, become available on the aftermarket, again if there is a substantial demand. It's purely business!
I understand you feel left out, but it is what it is.
Last edited by oldcutlass; August 29th, 2012 at 03:56 PM.
August 29th, 2012, 04:31 PM
#3
Got wood? I do! (an '89)
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Southeast Michigan
Posts: 310
[http://www.classiccarclub.org/grand_...classics.html]
They also list:
"CLASSIC CAR
When used by the Classic Car Club of America, it is an exclusive list that includes only specific important marques built between largely between 1925 and 1948. The term is often applied loosely by owners to any car."
and
CLASSIC
"(Br.) Post WW-2 collectable car. These are not the cars CCCA is talking about, but our friends in the UK are. We are indeed two nations separated by a common language."
So you're right in there being no CCCA-approved "Classic" Oldsmobiles, but there are LOTS of "classic" ones.
[Not to seem so snarky, but words ARE my bidness...]
August 29th, 2012, 06:11 PM
#4
Old(s) Fart
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 47,446
The availability of parts has nothing to do with age and everything to do with popularity. There are precious few Custom Cruisers of any age still on the road. Parts stores want to turn inventory. Parts for a mid-80s Chevy or Ford pickup will certainly be in stock. Parts for a car with few remaining - not so much.
As for your woodgrain trim, it's available and expensive because it is NOT shelf paper. It's very thick vinyl that's UV stable. 3M sells rolls of it.
Also, most parts store counter persons are clueless about anything that's more than five years old or isn't a Chevy or Honda or F250. Do a little on-line searching and you'll be amazed as to what's available for the 1980s CCs. Most engine parts, header panel, bumper fillers, bumpers, doors, and many trim parts. The sheet metal from the firewall back is identical to that on ALL 1980-1990 B-body wagons, as is the suspension and frame. Brake parts are so inexpensive that it is cheaper to buy a new rotor or drum than to have an old one turned. And, they are in stock (at least they are here in Northern VA).
As for your woodgrain trim, it's available and expensive because it is NOT shelf paper. It's very thick vinyl that's UV stable. 3M sells rolls of it.
Also, most parts store counter persons are clueless about anything that's more than five years old or isn't a Chevy or Honda or F250. Do a little on-line searching and you'll be amazed as to what's available for the 1980s CCs. Most engine parts, header panel, bumper fillers, bumpers, doors, and many trim parts. The sheet metal from the firewall back is identical to that on ALL 1980-1990 B-body wagons, as is the suspension and frame. Brake parts are so inexpensive that it is cheaper to buy a new rotor or drum than to have an old one turned. And, they are in stock (at least they are here in Northern VA).
August 29th, 2012, 07:38 PM
#6
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Location: Lawrence, KS
Posts: 26
August 30th, 2012, 06:59 AM
#7
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Poteau, Ok
Posts: 40,624
I did not proclaim to be a writer, however I can write, thanks for the grammer lesson! My pet peave is about old cars being referred to as "Classics", and understandably you got my point. You were not referring to people in the UK with your first post, and outside of licensing, guess what, their definition of Classic is the same.
The wiki site quotes the CCCA requirements and I used it because it explained your incorrect reference well. Don't shoot the mssenger here.
So here's the situation: We have old(er) cars that are "classics" and for which there are now making replacement parts and then new(er) ones for which you can pretty much find everything at a dealer (for 10 years by law), auto parts place, etc.
We won't touch on your grammer here, because "words are your bidness"!
The wiki site quotes the CCCA requirements and I used it because it explained your incorrect reference well. Don't shoot the mssenger here.
So here's the situation: We have old(er) cars that are "classics" and for which there are now making replacement parts and then new(er) ones for which you can pretty much find everything at a dealer (for 10 years by law), auto parts place, etc.
We won't touch on your grammer here, because "words are your bidness"!
August 30th, 2012, 09:01 AM
#11
I have a buddy who makes his money that way. He goes to the junkyards and pulls trim and all sorts of misc. stuff on mid-80s cars(especially mustangs).
He makes a few hundred a week selling 2nd and 3rd gen mustang parts that are popular cars but not popular enough for manufacturers to start re-poping the hell out of them.
I would check ebay if you need something. Be prepared to pay $50+ for a $10 part though.
He makes a few hundred a week selling 2nd and 3rd gen mustang parts that are popular cars but not popular enough for manufacturers to start re-poping the hell out of them.
I would check ebay if you need something. Be prepared to pay $50+ for a $10 part though.
August 30th, 2012, 09:01 AM
#12
I know there was a time when my father sold his 72 Hurst back in late 1988, because at that time is was in need of some work but parts weren't readily available, but now look.. theres parts everywhere for them. Too bad he didn't know then whats out there now, or how much those are going for. But right now I'm running into that issue with my 84. Trim pieces and little odds and end pieces now are near impossible to find, because apparently even though that body style is 30 years old now, and considered to be a classic or whatever you want to call it, lol, places like Year One or other reman parts depots don't feel the demand is there for my body style, which I feel is very sad.
August 31st, 2012, 07:19 AM
#13
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Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,452
I know there was a time when my father sold his 72 Hurst back in late 1988, because at that time is was in need of some work but parts weren't readily available, but now look.. theres parts everywhere for them. Too bad he didn't know then whats out there now, or how much those are going for. But right now I'm running into that issue with my 84. Trim pieces and little odds and end pieces now are near impossible to find, because apparently even though that body style is 30 years old now, and considered to be a classic or whatever you want to call it, lol, places like Year One or other reman parts depots don't feel the demand is there for my body style, which I feel is very sad.
August 31st, 2012, 08:46 AM
#14
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Vancouver BC
Posts: 601
All your comments are very interesting. Seems we are stuck in the "middle". I have been a "car guy" for almost 50 years. My father is a very well known car guy. He was inducted into the BC motorsport hall of fame. So it's in the blood. I have seen all the fades come and go. One of the things I like about our Olds is the uniqueness at car shows. I have seen SOOO many mustangs, camaro's, chevelle's vette it gets boring. The 1932 Ford roadsters is consider the iconic hot rod. Yes my dad has one (since 1952) How many were originally produced or survived? I have seen over 700 at one show. How many 69 Camareo RS SS were originally produced and survived? I have seen over 50 at one show. The point being they are popular, people want them and they will buy ,make ,create whatever to get one. So vendors are making parts to meet the demand. How many 1977 olds were made? Apparently over a million. How many survived? How many do you see at car shows? Not many. Were did they all go? Crusher. Because the were considered basic transportation. Like a Honda today. So here is the irony. When car's are originally "rare" people want them. Vendors produce them and now everyone has them. When car's are originally plentiful and you see one every day there is not much demand other than replacement parts.
So here we are today 69 Camero's RS SS , 70 Chevelle 396, etc, plentiful.
1977 oldsmobile not so easy to find anymore. But that why I like the Old's. Now it's rare. Besides I like the hunt for the parts to bring it all together. Go to a show and people ask were did you find that part or this hard to find part. You tell the story of the hunt. Not much fun saying I order it from OPG on-line and I recieved it in 3 days.
But that me and what I like doing with my time.
Mike
So here we are today 69 Camero's RS SS , 70 Chevelle 396, etc, plentiful.
1977 oldsmobile not so easy to find anymore. But that why I like the Old's. Now it's rare. Besides I like the hunt for the parts to bring it all together. Go to a show and people ask were did you find that part or this hard to find part. You tell the story of the hunt. Not much fun saying I order it from OPG on-line and I recieved it in 3 days.
But that me and what I like doing with my time.
Mike
September 1st, 2012, 06:52 AM
#16
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