plonka

I saw this 77 Cutlass in my area yesterday, called the guy and told him I'd like to look at it. He met me at a local car show. He told me the car was totally original, 20k miles, original paint , roof, interior, engine etc... Upon closer inspection, I noticed it had been repainted, the interior had been dyed and was splotchy, the landau roof was perfect and had all modern trim. The engine was painted from top to bottom and had many runs in the paint. New replacement under hood insulation and on and on. He kept saying how original and untouched the car was. I didn't have the desire to tell him he was full of it. He was probably in his late 60's, so he should know what he's talking about. Why lie about what's clearly obvious? Would you have called BS on him or let it go. I had no desire to buy it since I already have a real untouched 76.http://myrtlebeach.craigslist.org/cto/3605708633.html

coppercutlass

i would call bs and i have but since im 23 im just some young punk .But what i kike to tell them afterwards is im a body man and painter by trade as my parting words . Im not out to call people out but if someone is telling me the wrong info i will politely try to correct it if they are presistent on bull**** me then i will be a smart@$$ when thry try to tell me i dont know what im talking about. Usually most ofthe things i call out are body and paint related im not a numbers match guy i know eough to hold my own but not enough to make claims.

z11375ss

I just walk on, and think to myself, what an idiot.

Butkusfan

Exactly what I would do. Wouldn't waste my time with someone like that.

Nilsson

Why would you if you were not interested in buying it. Now, if you drove miles and wasted your time to buy an original, yes.

MDchanic

I'd play kinda dumb and go with the "Are you sure?" or, if I were inclined, the "Buddy, I hate to tell you..." line of discussion.

If he's saying the car is dead-stock original, for instance, that "Rocket" air cleaner sticker is wrong.

Also, a repaint won't be obvious if it was top-notch (glass out, etc), but it will be if it wasn't, and there's no arguing around it.

The original engine paint had runs, so I'd be more likely to call it if it didn't.

But, yeah, I'd say something to him about wasting my time.

- Eric

DENT

I drove 2 hours to look at a 72 Cutlass S , the seller claimed original paint low miles and well kept . Of course it wasn't , it had 1/4's welded over the old (very obvious in the trunk) and big patches welded in the frame. I politely pointed out all the flaws and then suggested it be sold as parts. He toke great offence and started using fowl language. So my wife and I bid him good day and drove off to the nearest Tim Hortons. It was kinda fun anyway. Lol. Adventures in car shopping.

oldcutlass

I'd just say not interested, shake my head, and walk. No need for a pissing contest, just let someone else be the bearer of the bad news.

jensenracing77

Before the internet a friend wanted to look at a low mile car in Long Island. the guy mailed us some pictures and it looked new. We drove from Brazil Indiana to Long Island to find out the car was trashed. He sent us pictures of the car from when he got it new. The car had the back glass siliconed in with it stringing to the package tray and all. My buddy called him every name in the book.

krooser

The guy probably bought it and he was told how original it was... he was probably clueless.

When I bought the stock car that's sitting in my shop the seller and I were looking under the hood and I noticed at least four places where the front frame had crash damage... just then he smiled and said "It's never been bent"!...hahaha.

Maybe he was blind...

m371961

I used to argue with people a lot more then I do now. Then I realized you tick them off more if you just shrug your shoulders and walk away. Different story if you travel to look at one and the seller posted old pictures.

ach1992880

Yep, sometimes it isn't worth having trying to have an intelligent conversation with people. Prior to buying my '71 S, I had emailed a guy about a '69 cutlass that he had for sale with a 455. I asked questions about the general condition of the body, interior, and frame, as well as asking if he knew what the 455 originally came out of. Upon posing that question and if he could give me the block number and tell me the letter from the heads (even told him where to find them), he replied that the 455 in the car was "from the car". When I responded that in 1969 the 455 wasn't available in the GM A body, and that if he had one with an original 455 that he had an H/O and it was worth much more than his asking price even for a builder his response was "are you young?" I'm 32, and pretty well informed, but he ended up blowing me off as some young punk... some people make the right decisions in life for you.

Greg Rogers

Sometimes people are just uninformed or just don't know. A buddy of mine bought a 63 Riviera for real cheap which ran but was it very poor shape- Rusty frame-bad floors etc. He immediatly took it to a body shop and had it painted. The body man made it look nice but it is basicly junk underneigth. I have heard him say its worth at least $10,000 and he gets that from auction results,etc But he really believes it. If he was to advertise it for sale i'm sure someone would be pissed if traveling a distance to see it.

z11375ss

I once went to look at a numbers matching 70 W-31. The guy wanted 4k for it. This was in about 1990. I pull up in my 69 442 that was VERY nice. The car was junk. I asked him to open the trunk and then stuck my hand down the side pulling up a hunk of goo. It had rained quite a bit peviously and he left it out. He convinced me to take it for a ride. It was a 4 speed car and I was thinking of restoring it etc thinking maybe I could get it for really cheap and then pour the money and time into it. I mentioned it was pretty tame for being a W-31, whereas he stated it didn't have the original motor anymore. He asked me what I thought and how much I was bid for the car. I just told him I didn't want the car at any price and didn't want to insult him with my appraisal. He still seemed pissed. Maybe because the car I pulled up in was 10x nicer than the one he was selling. I didn't quibble about the originality however, I let it go and got out of there.

drop top olds

It has a 260 in it for crying out loud. $12,500 not hardly.

plonka

Which is exactly why I didn't say anything. I just wanted to see an "all original car" to compare mine with, since 76-77 Cutlass' are not very common here in SC nor are they the most desirable. He did tell me that he did not have the car registered, but had just thrown a Georgia tag on it so he could drive it around. I did not tell him that I was a police officer and that was probably not a good idea.

Diego

Because he's a senior citizen, he's omniscient? I dunno . . . the older they are, the more likely they are to be mistaken and stubborn about it - even from people who sold them new.

TripDeuces

I'd have to weigh my options and decide if calling someone out was worthwhile or beneficial to what you're trying to achieve.
If you're buying the car and trying to get a lower price then it might be worth it. If it's sitting at a car show I'd just nod my head and keep walking. I think originals are easy to pick out, not numbers matching but just original old iron. I think it's far to easy to tell when someone has worked on it.

CRUZN 66

For the most part, I would just ask a few simple questions related to issues with the vehicle... For example, If the paint is original, why are there runs in it? Why are there discolored spots in the interior? etc.... At least this way the seller can see that the defects are obviously quite apparent and should change the sales pitch.... If he just BS's you even more, then just walk away............

GAOldsman

X2 And I would if it was very obvious and feel that someone was trying to deceive.

citcapp

Its easier on myself just to walk away. As I have gotten older things like this don't get to me anymore. Can't fix stupid

Rocket331

I've found by asking a number of questions you already know the answer to is a good way to figure out if the guy is trying to blow smoke up your rear or if he just doesn't know any better. If I determine he's outright lying, I'll walk away. If I think he just doesn't know any better, I have no qualms about politely telling him of my observations. Maybe he'll learn something. In the end, it's buyer beware!

jaunty75

Exactly right.

In this case, I would have gently pointed out the various aspects of the car that belie his claims of originality, and ask him how long has he owned the car and exactly what does he know about its history. It may very well be that he was duped when he bought the car and really believes it to be original.

Or he may have been duped when he bought the car, realized it afterwards, and is hoping to find someone as uninformed as he was to sell it to. In either case, I WOULD tell him, as nicely as possible, why it's not as original as he thinks it is. He can either accept that and more accurately represent the car as he continues to try to sell it, or he can ignore what you said and continue to try to pass it off as original. He'll either get lucky and sell it to someone uninformed, or he'll continue to have people telling him that it's not as original as he claims, the car won't sell, and he'll eventually realize the error of his ways.

Rickman48

Takes a bigger man to walk away - as I've done many times. Why argue?

Indy_68_S

This ^

GAOldsman

As Nillson pointed out, if you drove a good piece to possibly purchase an unmolested car and it was misrepresented in so many ways. I would peacefully point out the discrepancies and advise that I am not interested any longer. If he then argued about his so called truthfulness, I would call BS, thank him for wasting my time and my gas and leave without any further argument.

BIGJERR

Thats a tough one......Kinda like when a guy tells you his SBO is 600hp and runs high nines.......You know it doesn't but is it worth the calling out,I probably would of made a comment in regards to the things I noticed and see what his reaction would of been....

plonka

Some interesting points. Maybe he was duped into thinking it was all original and that's why he didn't have the car titled;he just wanted to sell it for what he bought it for. I just didn't know whether he was full of it or misinformed. Either way, I'm not the kind of person to call someone out when I have no interest in buying. I wanted to ask him where he got the nice replacement hood insulation from, but why bother, he would have said it was original

squirell

I love when people tell ME that stuff on my car is wrong.

My 70 454 LS-6 Chevelle has 39,000 orig miles,my brother bought it from the orig owner in 1974 with 5,000 miles on it AND the orig owner is a very good friend of mine.
Needless to say I know the car from day one,not to mention I have build sheet,window sticker,POP,invioces from when ordered and picked up.

People come up to me at shows and tell me my car's not an orig or not an LS-6 because it has an AIR pump and smog tubes in the exsaust manifolds.
I used to get mad cause they have no clue and even show them the build sheet clearly stating LS-6 and AIR pump.
I also used to explain people took that stuff off...NOT put it on.

Now I'm just like.... OK you must be right enjoy the show.

Then they point out that it's not orig paint because the stripes are sloppy and there's overspray in the trunk.
I politly tell them if the stripes are perfect IT'S NOT ORIG.GM was sloppy back then !!

Some people have no clue.

When I see that other cars that aren't right....I keep it to myself.
I don't go to car shows to be annoyed and argue with people.
I go to have fun

Lady72nRob71

I would question the obvious just to watch the BS meter to peg full-scale (or get a good laugh), then walk.
Never argue with an idiot, as bystanders won't be able to tell who's who...

Summerof84

In this particular case, it's a waste of time to even go look at it.
Hint: Worm clamps on the hoses. Now throw in the wrong air cleaner decal, the painted brake booster and master cylinder, and "all original except for alternator and tires" is out the door already.
Secondly, why would a 20k alternator need replacing? Maybe the diode trio could go bad, so replacing that to keep the alternator original is the best step.

Redog

I agree. I looked at a 79 Delta and I asked the guy on the phone "What engine is in it?" and he told me a 350. In that year, could have been a Chevy or an Olds. I pop the hood and it was the first time I was a Pontiac motor. I didn't even know what it was until I saw "4.9L 301"

I said, ummm this is a 301, and he was like "yeah" You said it had a 350, and he's like "No I didn't" so in 20 minutes, he forgot the conversation we had. So I humored him and drove the car. Going around the block, the car stalled about 30 times. No lie.

Just like this car, it photographed very very very well, if it looks as bad in person as you say it does

In that case, I would have too. That's a 2 day round trip right there

MaxDog

I would not, its just not worth it. Unless of course I told the person ahead of time that I was traveling a significant distance to come see what it is they were selling. But of course, in that instance I would insist on a high level of photographic proof that the item is what they say it is before I travel.

If they tricked me with the photos and managed to make the item appear to be something it is not, then I would demand that they pay for my travel. Of course they will refuse, at which point I will tell them that I am an attorney and I am going to sue their *** and make their life hell for about a year. If they still won't pay, I don't think its worth it to go any further and I just walk away with the hope that they will think twice about trying to pull that **** on someone else.

HonestDave

I've gone to look at so many cars, and seen so many stupid/disappointing things, I assume they're going to be crap before I go, but I love looking anyway. I don't call people out on the faults, very much, I just don't care. If they purposely tricked me into driving for hours with an obvious deception, well, I'd probably be cranky. Luckily I don't drive far to look at a car.
Last year I drove an hour each way to look at a 64 Impala ss 327 4 speed in "good driveable shape". When I got there the frame was rusted right through and the rear bumper hanging. I was disappointed, but still managed to enjoy a two hour conversation with him. Likeable fellow, just shifty. Have to admit, that irritated me some. Felt sorry for the people he said were coming from out of town.

OLD SKL 69

I guess it depends. If it was a private seller, I would probably ask a few questions and then politely leave.

When I went to a car dealer to buy a used Dodge Magnum R/T, the salesperson told me it was all original and untouched.
(Checked by their service dept) When I got there, I could tell it was completely repainted. I let that salesperson know I wasn't happy since it was so obvious that it redone and I was traveling from about 2 hours away.